Home › Forum Online Discussion › General › Nei-Yeh as source of Alchemical formulas?
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October 22, 2007 at 12:07 am #25226
I’m not much into doctrinaire discussions anymore, so I beg your pardon for a brief viewpoint.
You’re both right, or the viewpoints of the masters you’re referring to are both correct, or some of us will unite into the One, and some of us will go on to exercise free will even after meeting/joining the One.
As above, so below. Essentially we’re arguing 2 basic viewpoints here. I assert that both viewpoints are valid and we are likely playing them out here. I suspect that each of us plays them out individually as well: sometimes just sitting, sometimes acting.
I also enjoy reading the canon. To me, it’s a story, especially in English. It becomes less of a story when I have first hand experience of what’s being described/transmitted. Until then I see no way that an absolute foundation can be constructed from them. And even then the foundation cannot include all of reality/humanity.
-ml
October 22, 2007 at 12:42 pm #25228“I am merely backing up the alchemical viewpoint, since if I simply agreed with Bagua, then my own practice would no longer be valid.”
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I dont deny your alchemical method, I just dont agree with a rigid intepretation of it as some seem to have and are so willing to be critical of other presentations.1. Whenever we present an alchemical viewpoint, there is an implied rejection of it as unnecessary by saying “all you need is to hold on to the one”, that I think is definitely important but there is more to it than that. This implies dissolution of the self, giving up of free will.
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I wish your alchemy will digest this once and for all. There is no dissouluton of the individual self, it comes and goes, its not a permanent thing, its your thoughts and the emotions and conditioning attached to it. Its real in the sense your experieince something, its false in that it is transient, comes and goes.How much free will do you have? The dream of some tao alchemists is they will be like the dream of god, an immortal that can do anything they want. good luck with that dream.
2. The position on whether the individuated self dissolves into the one or achieves a symbiosis with it and maintains its own free will makes certain practices different than others.
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It never left the one, you cant be part of the one sometimes and not othertimes, its only your belief that your thoughts and emotions are really you that creates the false viel. The individual self does not have the ability to make that decision.3. Spiritual terms are not being used clearly and blanket generalizations are used as a means of glossing over points in a discussion rather than processing them. Spirituality as a “science”, or something that can be cultivated with particular results (albeit they are different for different people), requires the use of some kind of consistent terminology; can you imagine a community having a discussion about gardening with no words for winter or summer?
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I have no interest in spirituality, I am only interested realization of one’s true nature, thats it, all else takes care of its self. And what ever method works I can support.4. I feel that the idea that the jing shen can scatter after death is a sore point in Baguas cosmology that he doesn’t like, and wants to invalidate by saying that “we are already eternal”, which is in effect trying to dissolve them now, or at least devalue their contribution to his present being by observing them but not acknowledging their value as much as the “original self”.
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If that is what you need go for it, if this is the step by step method you need go for it, just dont imply everybody must follow that method. Im open to the fact you need this model, and give you the fredom to do it, but not all will need it.Can you personally confirm for a fact that you will scatter in the cosmos at physical death? Or is it just a belief you have?
“we come from the original self, and have never left it, but are vibrationally far removed and appear to be separated out in the physical plane. By saying we are only the original self is insulting to the physical self that sustains us here. Either we can dissolve back into the original self or try and bring it here by active harmonization, creating a third resonance, that of physical essence infused with the original self.”
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This view is so polarizing, so splitting, not all of us see or experience this type of dichotomy in our life. So if you need to travel that path great, but please dont demand we all follow this “human made” method. Basically this method seeks to split the life in tiny segements and tries to restore them into a unified whole, not realizing the unified whole already exsited.regards,
bagua
October 22, 2007 at 3:09 pm #25230Here’s Dr. Roths Interview on a few goodies below.
slOctober 22, 2007 at 3:21 pm #25232Very nice interview, thanks for posting.
bagua
October 24, 2007 at 2:21 am #25234>>”I dont deny your alchemical method, I just dont agree with a rigid intepretation of it as some seem to have and are so willing to be critical of other presentations.”
Your position is still rather unclear to me, but feel free to practice however you see fit. I prefer alchemical cooking coupled with the inner observer as it gives me a feeling of substance and permanence, that the process is continuing even when I am not “practicing the meditation”, when just observing the inner planes. I feel the effect is greater for me than just observing without the alchemical cooking, but that is my preference and may not be for everyone.
>>”I wish your alchemy will digest this once and for all. There is no dissouluton of the individual self, it comes and goes, its not a permanent thing, its your thoughts and the emotions and conditioning attached to it. Its real in the sense your experieince something, its false in that it is transient, comes and goes.”
Thanks for your viewpoint. I don’t necessarily agree with it. See explanation above.
>>”How much free will do you have? The dream of some tao alchemists is they will be like the dream of god, an immortal that can do anything they want. good luck with that dream.”
Thanks for your well wishes. We don’t know what is possible unless we try do we? It may be small or big or both at the same time.
>>”It never left the one, you cant be part of the one sometimes and not othertimes, its only your belief that your thoughts and emotions are really you that creates the false viel. The individual self does not have the ability to make that decision.”
I answered this in posts above, thanks again for your viewpoint. It is not one that I subscribe to.
>>”I have no interest in spirituality, I am only interested realization of one’s true nature, thats it, all else takes care of its self. And what ever method works I can support.”
Enjoy
>>”If that is what you need go for it, if this is the step by step method you need go for it, just dont imply everybody must follow that method. I’m open to the fact you need this model, and give you the fredom to do it, but not all will need it.”
I enjoy the gradual method that fuses shen with jing because of its substance, and the practice creates a permanent effect of digestion or “cooking” that lasts throughout the day and night.
>>”Can you personally confirm for a fact that you will scatter in the cosmos at physical death? Or is it just a belief you have?”
I only use my own experience during waking, sleep and practice as a gauge of my ability to be integrated.
>>”This view is so polarizing, so splitting, not all of us see or experience this type of dichotomy in our life. So if you need to travel that path great, but please dont demand we all follow this “human made” method. Basically this method seeks to split the life in tiny segements and tries to restore them into a unified whole, not realizing the unified whole already exsited.”
Please feel free to experience life as you see fit. Is your method “made by nature” and not by man, or is it just how you like to experience it? Each human has the freedom to choose how they approach that experience. Give thanks to all the previous teachers that made it possible by their will to pass on these maps, giving us the freedom to choose.
I think I explained it quite well in that we are born and die in each moment from the unknown source, yet how many humans feel such a close connection to it that they can be one in each moment? by mapping the birthing process, we also map the return, and by mapping the return bring both into the present (physical) reality. For me the goal is not realization but experience of the process.
October 24, 2007 at 2:58 am #25236Message
I will answer more when I have more time. Dissolution and free will are a large part of the discussion.Not quite sure what you mean by “life” and “essence”.
Part of the question may be do we dissolve back into the wuji or does the dissolution result in those unresolved aspects coming back to further seek resolution (where the ancestral line seeks to resolve aspects from before it, “the sins of the fathers are passed on the the offspring”)?
If a person can be “unified” with a deep dimensional level of self, with jing holding that high vibration of neutral force, it can unify and dissolve much of the extreme yin and yang that is now in the world.
I experience a much more tangible result from working with elemental forces than with practicing realization. It is my preference.
My point about validity of practice is that I get the feeling that certain people do not want to allow me the free will to practice this (to “give it validity”), and insist upon it being unnecessary.
I think the question is both one of method and goal, and the answer may be left up to the pracitioners to determine through experience:
1. Does the experience of your practice create a substantial feeling of neutrality that can dissolve extreme polarities?
2. If your goal is to dissolve into the one, what are you dissolving into? How do you gage that feeling of the one, how do you experience it?
3. If your goal is to unify the shen, how do you experience that through the daily process, and through “unconscious” periods like sleep?
4. What is the overall experience of the effects of meditation or observation, how “deep” do you feel you are in the process?
October 24, 2007 at 7:24 am #25238>>Not quite sure what you mean by “life” and “essence”.<>I experience a much more tangible result from working with elemental forces than with practicing realization. It is my preference.<>Part of the question may be do we dissolve back into the wuji or does the dissolution result in those unresolved aspects coming back to further seek resolution (where the ancestral line seeks to resolve aspects from before it, “the sins of the fathers are passed on the the offspring”)?<>If a person can be “unified” with a deep dimensional level of self, with jing holding that high vibration of neutral force, it can unify and dissolve much of the extreme yin and yang that is now in the world.<>My point about validity of practice is that I get the feeling that certain people do not want to allow me the free will to practice this (to “give it validity”), and insist upon it being unnecessary.<<
… and my point is that, since they cannot at all *affect* how you choose to *use* this free will, it makes absolutely no difference. What someone else says about what is valid is entirely irrelevant if you know what you are doing is correct for you. Even Buddha said, ignore me if you think I'm wrong. Does Bagua say the same? Well he should!
It is quite clear to me that those who choose to try and convince others they are 'practicing wrongly' are doing so out of ego alone – presuming that those others are actually happy in their practice which you obviously are. Naturally different schools may have blind spots; individuals may succumb to self-delusion; difficulties may creep in that need resolution by reference to an outside point of view. That's why we all talk like this! All spiritual paths can help one another. But the idea that there is something *fundamentally wrong* with the whole *concept behind an entire spiritual path* is blatant rubbish of the first order. Anyone who says otherwise is barking mad! ๐ ๐ ๐ That is not helping one another, it is correcting one another when no correction is needed.
To my mind your other questions are only trying to rehash the argument still further. j
October 24, 2007 at 9:48 am #25240>>Part of the question may be do we dissolve back into the wuji or does the dissolution result in those unresolved aspects coming back to further seek resolution (where the ancestral line seeks to resolve aspects from before it, “the sins of the fathers are passed on the the offspring”)?<<
This happens all the time anyway in this universe, the question is, where in that process is the entity we can call – 'you'? ๐
If you have genuinely and entirely dissolved yourself back, then 'unresolved aspects which return to seek further resolution' are ALL you. You have become the ENTIRE PROCESS. There is no longer a part which separates off again from 'you', 'you' are ALL OF IT – the part that splits off, the part that doesn't, the part that recombines, the part that never needed to recombine, the result of the recombination – ALL OF THIS AT ONCE and probably alot more! You have as Lu Dong Bin said 'become unfathomable'.
But if you do not dissolve youself you can see yourself as BOTH all of this and ALSO continue personal evolution into something personally greater, something which I feel this universe is aiming at producing. You can be enlightened and aware of everything in a timeless sense but at the same time someone individual still learning.
The choice is yours, it is your free will, it depends entirely (like everything) on your own understanding of your own situation and your decision on what to do about it.
There is absolutely no conflict between seeking the centre and developing spiritual skill with the elements, or any other spiritual skill.
There is no conflict between wishing to develop essence so that mind connects with What Is Great, and developing life so that What Is Great becomes embodied.
There is no 'ultimate aim' that all practices share.
As a matter of fact IMHO Bagua is quite wrong to denigrate the 'becoming a powerful immortal' approach – I think he does so because he hasn't realized, such people continue to grow and change and experience more and more, and as a result they face ever greater challenges to themselves and their paths become broader and more encompassing, and their humility ever greater, they do not become more and more egotistical – quite the opposite! Such people are all around us, again, I relate my own experience only. But this perhaps is not what is imagined by those who seek to become immortal when they start out! I agree with that. I only say that before they actually *become* immortal they will have to learn differently!
In addition, I would say that I believe this universe is *meant* to train us to understand and use power, also to develop wisdom, understand love, be more and more alive and more and more conscious. Thus I choose and will continue to choose for some 'time' not to dissolve myself just yet; I believe I have much still to learn that can do both myself and others and the universe the power of good.
Now I don't at all denigrate anyone who thinks differently – but perhaps I should say, anyone who *thinks* they think differently. After all, which of the many spiritual ways appears to believe most strongly in the dissolution of the ego? Buddhism! But which tradition's highest practitioners are those who return again and again to embodiment to learn more? Buddhism again! The doctrines mislead; only practicing gives true information; the practices are different, they are personal. They are for different people. People are not better nor worse then each other. Neither are practices, at least, not the principles behind each practice.
I covered all this in the previous post. I don't see any argument here as I say; I am trying to say why there is no argument. j
October 25, 2007 at 2:29 am #25242Hello Nnonnth,
Thanks for your in-depth thoughts on the issue, I really am being honest in that I still do not understand what you mean when you say “life” and “essence”. Cleary was basically a buddhist and relied heavily on that even when translating daoist texts; that does not discount his skill as a translator, only that I am not familiar with the terms. If you talk in terms of jing-qi-shen transformation, then it makes more sense to me. I would see buddhist practice as focused mainly on qi, shen and mental body cultivation, and not transforming the jing as much (except for tibetan practices), but really I am not all that familiar with most buddhist practice other than reading some sutras and hearing about vipassana meditation.
“life” is a very general term, and essence can mean either jing or qi depending on the translator.
>>”‘Working with elemental forces’ is cultivating life; ‘practicing realization’ is cultivating essence. Substitute those into my original post and I believe I answered all of your other questions.”
this makes a little more sense.
>>”Answered in my original post. The answer is it depends on the free will of the practitioner. If you reach a certain stage you *choose* to come back and resolve more things, or you *choose* not to return but to dissolve yourself permanently. Until you have reached the stage where you can *choose* either one the whole conversation is entirely premature!”
Being at the stage of choosing to come back or not seems to be a high level of cultivation of free will. I was referring to the fragmented shen reorganizing themselves and coming back to physicality in a different configuration (different person) to try and resolve their issues again because it couldn’t be done before.
>>”Yes; my point was that this can occur from still sitting practices. Also that it does not *always* occur from those practices. Those practices which only ‘cultivate essence’ and do not concern themselves with ‘cultivating life’, do not try to dissolve these differences at jing level. Those practices which *begin with* cultivating essence may in the end do precisely that and (however much I dislike his very negative attitude towards practices like the ones on this site) Huai-Chin Nan’s practices are the proof of it. I repeat, *as I already pointed out in my other post which answers you completely*, *primarily* cultivating essence does not mean that you do not *come* to cultivate life, nor vice versa. When it comes to mastery both schools are one. The entire point of what I said is that (as Dolphin mentioned) you are both right. The argument is tired; I am not convinced there was ever anything in it.”
My point here is that I am unsure and would question whether realization practices do transform jing at a deep level. Whether both schools achieve mastery, I guess is also a question left up to those people who do actually achieve mastery from either school.
>>”… and my point is that, since they cannot at all *affect* how you choose to *use* this free will, it makes absolutely no difference. What someone else says about what is valid is entirely irrelevant if you know what you are doing is correct for you. Even Buddha said, ignore me if you think I’m wrong.”
True
๐>>”It is quite clear to me that those who choose to try and convince others they are ‘practicing wrongly’ are doing so out of ego alone – presuming that those others are actually happy in their practice which you obviously are. Naturally different schools may have blind spots; individuals may succumb to self-delusion; difficulties may creep in that need resolution by reference to an outside point of view. That’s why we all talk like this! All spiritual paths can help one another. But the idea that there is something *fundamentally wrong* with the whole *concept behind an entire spiritual path* is blatant rubbish of the first order. Anyone who says otherwise is barking mad! ๐ ๐ ๐ That is not helping one another, it is correcting one another when no correction is needed.”
Generally someone who practices any kind of spirituality (“practicing virtue”) I think is positive except if they are of the missionary sort, or are trying to deny particular aspects of existence like physicality as being more or less than “our true nature”, it really includes both and everything inbetween. Realizing that there is a distance between “our true nature” and pure physical existance does not cause a split in my view, it just accepts the distance AND proposes a solution. Some people don’t need to “do the steps” of alchemy to complete their lives here, yet I believe that alchemy does accelerate the process and has the potential take things a few steps further than if someone just seeks physical completion. “going with the flow” seems to me to be somewhat different than “becoming the process of change” by acknowledging and embodying it.
Discussion is just more fire under the pot!
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October 25, 2007 at 5:29 am #25244>>My point here is that I am unsure and would question whether realization practices do transform jing at a deep level.<>Being at the stage of choosing to come back or not seems to be a high level of cultivation of free will.<>I was referring to the fragmented shen reorganizing themselves and coming back to physicality in a different configuration (different person) to try and resolve their issues again because it couldn’t be done before.<>Realizing that there is a distance between “our true nature” and pure physical existance does not cause a split in my view, it just accepts the distance AND proposes a solution.<<
It's interesting that you say that since I don't see this 'distance' myself… but perhaps it's not important j
October 25, 2007 at 7:04 am #25246Finally catching up after my travels and teaching wuji gong this weekend. It seems that qigong practice followed by meditation produces deeper results that intellectual discussion, but we also seem to need both to keep our “life” and “essence” in harmony.
1. That is the first clarification, on Cleary’s translation.
Life = Ming, aka destiny in the world.
Essence = Xing, inner nature, aka spiritual destiny
2. Northern and Southern Schools are atttempts to simplify a whole range of practices. One Cloud probably left a Northern School order to seek his Way in the mountains of northern China. He was probably NOT out there teaching sexual practices to folks. It was assumed in his monastic tradition, at least the single cultivation practice (internal circulation of sexual energy).
The dual practice (couples having sex) was integrated by Mantak Chia from other Taoists. I support that because it is more relevant to modern adepts in the West – very few are living in caves/huts apart from sex/society.
3. The ongoing One vs. Many Debate
Just to clarify my previous position, I wasn’t attacking Buddhist for choosing to meditate however they chose to – I was disagreeing with claims made by Max that led to the same as Taoist alchemical practice.
And I was pointing out the post-natal impossibility of any two different people having the exact same meditation or any life experience, even though they may be drawing their experiences from a common primordial ground.
The above discussion of choosing to dissolve into the One vs. choosing to reincarnate, etc. must be viewed more realistically in terms of level of Will achieved by an individual at the moment of physical death. And please note that MERGING into the One and DISSOLVING into the One are not the same process; merging I belives preserves the individual will, albeit with total integration and harmony with the collective.
Dissolving into the One: I doubt this is an act of will by the individual, more likely it is a higher level of collective self ABSORBING its post-natal individual projection back into its greater self because that individual self has ceased its conscious evolution or has no furtaeher mission, i.e. it lacks the integration/will/destiny to continue and so is automatically taken by into its immediate higher level source where in a sense it lives entirely through the creativity of the collective (oversoul) that has absorbed it.
4. My concern about Nan Huai Chin type of Buddhists (Nothingness is All you Need) is that they are a kind of Fundamentalist Buddhist who seem to be expressing their desire to obliterate the process of both the post-natal Self and the pre-natal self (soul). That this anti-self desire, if expressed deeply enough in the life, might limit the options available to them at death.
I cannot know this for sure, it just seems a likelihood. It’s also possible at death they would suddenly experience the ongoing creative fullness of creation and choose to reverse their post-natal belief and achieve sufficient integration “from the corpse” to go on creating.
My other concern was that certain types of meditation practice might not address the binary nature of the soul, but simply choose to split it further through beliefs and practices that the “formless” or empty aspect of self was more real thanits form aspect. That by bypassing this tension in the binary soul, you don’t resolve it, and may exacerate the tension.
But I think Harold Roth interview put it really clear: the Taoists belive in continuous creation, there is no absolute emptiness to be achieved, only greater depths of “de”/spiritual power to be expressed.
This is why I find Bagua’s position on the One as being pre-existent and thus “already achieved” to be confusing the issue of post-natal practice/potential achievement.
The One is simply another name for the collective of creation, which apparently will endure no matter what we do. But the experience of each “cell” of the One changes the experience of the One. So One is also in process – we are part of that process.
I don’t think Oneness should be confused with the notion of the futility of the individual self seeking to deepen the One’s experience of itself. That implies the One is fixed, and thus somehow limited. Better to see individiual selves as reflections of the One, we hold the One inside of us and we mutually shape each other.
peace,
Michaelps. I will get to other threads tomrorrow.
October 25, 2007 at 7:17 am #25248NN: Now I don’t at all denigrate anyone who thinks differently – but perhaps I should say, anyone who *thinks* they think differently. After all, which of the many spiritual ways appears to believe most strongly in the dissolution of the ego? Buddhism!
But which tradition’s highest practitioners are those who return again and again to embodiment to learn more? Buddhism again! The doctrines mislead; only practicing gives true information; the practices are different, they are personal. They are for different people. People are not better nor worse then each other. Neither are practices, at least, not the principles behind each practice.NN,
This is my experience of many Buddhists – their practice is different than their cosmology. The cosmology I find a confused and negative, filled with judgements about life as primarily suffering that needs to be escaped; but many have strong practices that are life-positive.My feeling si that the reason for this discrepancy is that buddhist cosmology is aimed at clearing the post-natal mind as the cause of suffering, and lacks a clear viewpoint on other levels of self (i.e. soul, oversoul, etc). But when they practice, the soul emerges and begins to function clearly and positively. I haven’t seen much evidence of focusing on resolving binary soul tension.
MW
October 25, 2007 at 8:37 am #25250>>The above discussion of choosing to dissolve into the One vs. choosing to reincarnate, etc. must be viewed more realistically in terms of level of Will achieved by an individual at the moment of physical death.<>And please note that MERGING into the One and DISSOLVING into the One are not the same process; merging I belives preserves the individual will, albeit with total integration and harmony with the collective.<>Dissolving into the One: I doubt this is an act of will by the individual<>4. My concern about Nan Huai Chin type of Buddhists (Nothingness is All you Need) is that they are a kind of Fundamentalist Buddhist who seem to be expressing their desire to obliterate the process of both the post-natal Self and the pre-natal self (soul). That this anti-self desire, if expressed deeply enough in the life, might limit the options available to them at death.<>My other concern was that certain types of meditation practice might not address the binary nature of the soul, but simply choose to split it further through beliefs and practices that the “formless” or empty aspect of self was more real thanits form aspect. That by bypassing this tension in the binary soul, you don’t resolve it, and may exacerate the tension.<>This is why I find Bagua’s position on the One as being pre-existent and thus “already achieved” to be confusing the issue of post-natal practice/potential achievement.<<
Well I don't want to get into that, I mean everything I'm posting is a way to say why I think that discussion is useless! Of COURSE 'the one thing' is everything! The thing is that the difference in time perception between it and ourselves makes it impossible to say it is already achieved, and impossible also to say it isn't! It's just a silly conversation to have. But I'm probably only opening more cans of merry little worms here. j
October 25, 2007 at 8:58 am #25252>>My feeling si that the reason for this discrepancy is that buddhist cosmology is aimed at clearing the post-natal mind as the cause of suffering, and lacks a clear viewpoint on other levels of self (i.e. soul, oversoul, etc).<>But when they practice, the soul emerges and begins to function clearly and positively. I haven’t seen much evidence of focusing on resolving binary soul tension.<<
Two things on that.
Firstly, no there is not much *said* about the resolution of that fundamental above and below into one thing – using the hermetic terms there. But I do see evidence from Nan that it *happens*. I tend to feel that we don't hear about it because it rather contradicts the doctrine! ๐ (which stubbornly insists there is 'nothing to resolve anyhow'.)
Secondly, I realize that you yourself have definitely made a break with the idea of physical immortality, in its 'ascension' guise, as a goal of taoism. I have read 'Awaken Healing Light' by now and was actually rather interested in the beginning where Mantak (ghost-written by you?) talks of those who disappear completely at death, those who leave hair and nails behind, those whose body remains but very significantly decreased in weight, and so forth.
The reason this interests me is that there is a similar pattern in western practice, and similar 'levels' of the withdrawal of physical substance appear there too. In fact one of my later blog posts will be about this very subject.
I realize that a) your practice does not focus on this, and b) the low-etheric (jing) root of the body is what is really transformed anyway, the physical simply 'going along for the ride' as it were – but still, it is interesting to me that there are times when it seems more or less of the physical body does even go for that ride during death itself. I connect this with astral projection practice and I'm sure that link will be obvious to you.
My question is therefore, do you think that physical 'ascension' (sorry I do not know the taoist term) is part of the practice of resolving the soul tension you are talking about? And also, do you consider the story of Ge Hong for instance, that talks about the disappearance of his entire physical body after his death, to be mere symbolism? j
October 25, 2007 at 4:55 pm #25254MW
>>This is why I find Bagua’s position on the One as being pre-existent and thus “already achieved” to be confusing the issue of post-natal practice/potential achievement.<<Nnonnth
Well I don't want to get into that, I mean everything I'm posting is a way to say why I think that discussion is useless! Of COURSE 'the one thing' is everything! The thing is that the difference in time perception between it and ourselves makes it impossible to say it is already achieved, and impossible also to say it isn't! It's just a silly conversation to have. But I'm probably only opening more cans of merry little worms here. j
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The Tao is everything, we are part of life and therefore part of Tao. Regardless of what our ego/I/intellect/Yi has been conditioned to beleive or shaped by society, parents or life's pathologies we are part of Tao and it is never separate from us, each person just needs to become aware of it and stop believing they are their thoughts and feelings and emotions. One Cloud alchemy is one possible method to achieve this, there are many others.We don't Merge into the One, we can't merge into what we already are, we just focus or become aware of what has always existed, this self realization results in our knowing our true nature and how the I/Ego/Yi/intellect functions is apparent. It does not destroy, kill or eliminate the I/Self/Ego, these are seen in the light of their true function, no more, no less; they will always function but how you respond to them is differnt. In this way your are free, free from the bondage and prison of the narrow ego/self/Yi, you are free to experience life in a normal, dyanmic, spontaneous and natural way.
It seems some just do not want to accept the reality they are complete as they are, they dont need to add things, look at much of life as life pathologies and allow what has always existed to be the center of your life. Your perceptions and your actions will be from this normal, natural awareness. What a dynamic, playful, amazing way to live life, ready to accept life in its changing, spontaneous cycles. This is living in the Tao. Qi Gong, Nei Gong, Tai Chi can guide this realization.
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