- This topic has 19 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 8 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Click on the link to get the photo edition. No password sign in required while it is still in first position in Tao News section (for those who hate getting my newsletter by email).
http://www.healingdao.com/cgi-bin/articles.pl?rm=mode2&articleid=133
I have also found the four pillar astrology useful in determining the balance of elements in my self and others (I bought the program in its first edition back in 2004, which I actually like the layout more than the 2nd edition).
According to the four pillar astrology book by David Twicken, it seems that the year animal/elements refer to your grandparents, the month animal/elements to your parents, the day animal/elements to your “core self” or day master, and the hour animal/elements to your children or siblings.
My question is how much does the year animal/elements influence you as opposed to the day master…is the day master more an indicator of your “true” personality, or the year animal?
My two cents:
The day master represents the stellar resonance of the moon. The location and spiritual vector (direction AND velocity) of the individual astral body within the collective field of stellar mind.
The year master marks where within the “seasons of the human collective” your soul enters the drama (it is defined by the wood-earth elemental relationship at the planetary level, one’s placement within Jupiter and Saturn cycles. What is humanity excited to start, what is it determined to finish? Is it more a time for creating new collective projects or more for completing old ones?)
I would say that the day energy marks more “where your individual essence is at” in relation to the vast cosmic field of possibility, while the year energy indicates your emotional orientation towards human events. The year energy is a cohort effect, meaning everyone born your year is going to share it, so it is less individually YOU and more the collective personality of your YEAR COHORT. I think of High School pep rallies where the Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, and Senior classes compete to see which group can cheer the loudest. A Chinese astrologer can just look at the year masters of the four cohorts to predict which would be most excited, aggressive, extroverted, etc (e.g. You’d expect a yang wood tiger cohort to roar pretty loud.)
Interested to hear other views.
Happy New Year,
Patrick
OK, thanks for the insights. So it appears that they would be different levels of a person’s personality. I guess my next question is how can one cultivate either the year or day master aspects of ones personality to make them more balanced or dominant?
Because we are really talking about the ten celestial stems (elements) and the 12 terrestrial stems (animals).I know in the chinese elemental system, the planets represent extensions of the five elements, is this also true for western (Vedic) astrology?
Hello Patrick:
Interesting perspective. Can you define some of the terms you use and “how” they relate to the Chinese calendar, which is not the same as the western calendar. And it does not really relate to planets like Western astrology and astronomy?
Some terms:
Stelar resonance of the moon.
Spiritual vector of the astral body.
Collective stellar mind.
seasons of the human collective.
Etc.
thanks,
bagua
The day master represents the stellar resonance of the moon. The location and spiritual vector (direction AND velocity) of the individual astral body within the collective field of stellar mind.
The year master marks where within the “seasons of the human collective” your soul enters the drama (it is defined by the wood-earth elemental relationship at the planetary level, one’s placement within Jupiter and Saturn cycles. What is humanity excited to start, what is it determined to finish? Is it more a time for creating new collective projects or more for completing old ones?)
I would say that the day energy marks more “where your individual essence is at” in relation to the vast cosmic field of possibility, while the year energy indicates your emotional orientation towards human events. The year energy is a cohort effect, meaning everyone born your year is going to share it, so it is less individually YOU and more the collective personality of your YEAR COHORT. I think of High School pep rallies where the Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, and Senior classes compete to see which group can cheer the loudest. A Chinese astrologer can just look at the year masters of the four cohorts to predict which would be most excited, aggressive, extroverted, etc (e.g. You’d expect a yang wood tiger cohort to roar pretty loud.)
Interested to hear other views.
Happy New Year,
Patrick
To answer your first question, I think I heard Master Chia say it best:
“Where the mind goes, the chi flows.”
As for yours second question, vedic astrological tradition is vast. Those more inclined to reduce things to their essences (as I often do in my work) would probably have little trouble accepting the Taoist view of the planets as representing the five elements. Those who more embrace the diversity and complexity of the “ten thousand things” would probably reject a five element model as overly simplistic.
Interesting perspective. Can you define some of the terms you use and “how” they relate to the Chinese calendar, which is not the same as the western calendar. And it does not really relate to planets like Western astrology and astronomy?
True. Chinese astrology seems to be guided by the principle Lao tzu mentions in chapter 25 of the Tao Te Ching (this amazing webpage compares 24 different translations line by line: http://wayist.org/ttc%20compared/chap25.htm)
“Man follows the ways of the Earth.
The Earth follows the ways of Heaven,
Heaven follows the ways of Tao,
Tao follows its own ways.”in that while western astrology seeks to connect the ways (cycles) of heaven directly with the ways of humanity, Chinese astrology charts out the intermediate cycles and rhythms of earth and seeks to connect those to human life. But those earthly rhythms follow the rhymes of heaven, the deeper and more essential cycles which determine the essence of earthly and thus human experience.
So while the day master marks the cyclical energetic breathing of sun moon and earth, the individual essence of each days energy is the essence of the relationship between the earth and the lunar constellation, as mediated by the moon.
Collective stellar mind refers to the field of collective consciousness embodied by the stars (stars as in “sun, moon, and stars” which includes nebulae, galaxies, galactic clusters, etc, not just stars.) Just as our little moon has it’s orientation within the vast cosmos, so does our own mind have its little place and direction within the vast field of consciousness, it’s own “vector” if you will.
As for the planetary aspect of the year masters, it seems to me that while the year masters do not directly record the cycles of the (heavenly) planetary bodies, they do represent the manifestation of planetary and stellar cycles as earth energy cycles. Heaven could thus be said to follow a ten year HEAVENLY YEAR in which there are five seasons (consisting of the five elements.) The twelve individuated divisions of the field of stellar consciousness (the twelve zodiacal animals) each in turn evolve in and out of the seasons of the heavenly years until all stellar energies have evolved through all seasons (energy phases), [every 120 year cycle.] These “seasonal” energies are experienced collectively as cohort qualities and have five phase energetic qualities (like growth and expansion during wood phases and contraction during water phases.)
Does this jibe with your model of the basis of the four pillar system?
Stelar resonance of the moon.
Spiritual vector of the astral body.
Collective stellar mind.
seasons of the human collective.
Etc.
thanks,
Interesting ideas. Whether they match the mechanics of the Chinese calendar takes some analysis.
So while the day master marks the cyclical energetic breathing of sun moon and earth, the individual essence of each days energy is the essence of the relationship between the earth and the lunar constellation, as mediated by the moon.
****************************
The Chinese calendar is a luni-solar calendar, with tools unique to its culture. Sometimes one aspect is emphasized, sometimes the other is, and sometimes combinations are used.Stems follow a pattern of 10-day and 30-day cycles, its more solar based.
As for the planetary aspect of the year masters, it seems to me that while the year masters do not directly record the cycles of the (heavenly) planetary bodies, they do represent the manifestation of planetary and stellar cycles as earth energy cycles. Heaven could thus be said to follow a ten year HEAVENLY YEAR in which there are five seasons (consisting of the five elements.) The twelve individuated divisions of the field of stellar consciousness (the twelve zodiacal animals) each in turn evolve in and out of the seasons of the heavenly years until all stellar energies have evolved through all seasons (energy phases), [every 120 year cycle.] These “seasonal” energies are experienced collectively as cohort qualities and have five phase energetic qualities (like growth and expansion during wood phases and contraction during water phases.)
***************************
Each of the five phases goes into a cycle of five or 12-stages of transformation, the phases are the same for each branch, the results can be different.Does this jibe with your model of the basis of the four pillar system?
***********************
Not sure.The essence of Chinese astrology is the integration of all pillars in the chart. You are trying to use a terminology/meaning that may not match this system. Every pillar is multi-facted and really cannot be narrowly attached to an area of life. Chinese astrology has its strengths and weaknesses, predicted other people’s lives and influences is not the most effective aspect of it.
To get to the essence of what you envision requires a step-by-step analysis of the Chinese calendar and the creation of the four pillars and 10-year fate cycles, in the mechanics is the theory of what contains the strongest influences.
regards,
baguaAny thoughts on how the year element/animal affects a persons personality versus the element/animal of the day master?
The key to Chinese astrology is learning how to integrate many aspects of the chart. Sometimes the year can be a predominant influence, sometimes its the month, day or hour, or combinations of them. There is so much to look at to find out the personality. For me its not about the year vs the day. The day is the centerpiece of the chart and a person. We look at how the entire chart influences the day stem/element, the imbalances in any of the pillars influence the day master, that is how it will show itself. In general, the month is the most powerful influence on the chart and day stem, not the year.
The year was emphasized because it was simple to find the year branch/animal; the animal name and qualities are a later addition. The Rabbit is Mao, which is Yin Wood, that’s its true meaning and its relationships to other stems and branches are how to evaluate its meaning. The rabbit can mean drastically different things to you than myself.
bagua
That makes sense that a rabbit for example could affect one person much differently than another depending on their personal configuration of elements/animals.
So if a person has a weak day master, then it is really about how all the other elements and animal aspects affect that day master…it is about the interaction of all of them, not the importance or dominance of the year vs day? I guess this is all about “looking at the big picture”, or the process and flow of interactions.
One representation of the integration of all four pillars is the five element composition (the percentages and circles given in bagua’s software.) The five element composition I believe can be read as various forces in tension. For instance, a weak day master element will always tend to make you more wealthy.
That makes sense that a rabbit for example could affect one person much differently than another depending on their personal configuration of elements/animals.
****************
Yes. Of the stems and branches and the 10-gods/deities and more.So if a person has a weak day master, then it is really about how all the other elements and animal aspects affect that day master…it is about the interaction of all of them, not the importance or dominance of the year vs day?
****************
Basically. There are unique combinations or interactions between them all and cycles of time that have important meanings too.I guess this is all about “looking at the big picture”, or the process and flow of interactions.
***************
Yes, and there are many parts to it.One representation of the integration of all four pillars is the five element composition (the percentages and circles given in bagua’s software.)
*****************
Yes, but it can be deceiving too. There are many other factors about those percentages: are the elements in root, what are the combinations of their stems and branches, etc.?The five element composition I believe can be read as various forces in tension. For instance, a weak day master element will always tend to make you more wealthy.
*******************
Not sure about that. A weak day master is the fp only. The 10-year cycles accounts for around 40% of the chart, so we need to read both at a given time to see what a person really is. If the weak day master is in weak cycles, if it were the wealth element/god it means wealth/element is the source of great stress.Also, a weak day master can be weaken by a few gods, like the child, grandparent, grandchild, not bu only wealth. Often very weak day masters mean their will be big swings in their life, so they need to be smart about dealing with this. This is where cultivation/alchemy can help.
So if I follow, the parts do not have meaning apart from seeing the unity of the integrated whole, but the whole can be decieving because one also needs to look at it’s parts.
Hmm…
Ever try cutting up an ox? 😉
I’m going to stick to a weak day master always pushing the balance towards more wealth. Isn’t it always true with the five elements that when a controlling element is weak, it’s “grandchild” expands?
But here is a related question: if a day master is weak, and the wealth element is strong, and “wealth” does in fact “run rampant,” because the day master grandparent element is not strong enough to control it, what would that look like, practically speaking?
Patrick
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.